Ebay Antics

Written in 2000, published RKS Newsletter Issue 48

Rhett asked me to write an article about dating Randall Made Knives. This was brought to fruition due to one of the topics discussed during the Randall Knife Society meeting at the Blade Show in Atlanta this year. The topic of concern was the misrepresentation of the age of Randall’s on the auction site ebay. Let’s face it; older knives tend to have more value.

Several members expressed their dismay at the egregious manner at which certain individuals have been basically dishonest in taking advantage of the less experienced collector. Not many sellers on Ebay are doing this intentionally but some are, and knowingly or unknowingly the end result is the same – a “gun shy” collector who is hesitant to invest in additional vintage knives for his/her collection. The fallout effect on eBay is that true vintage items don’t get the number of bids they deserve and don’t reach the value they should bring, while current knives are selling like hotcakes for probably more than they should.

Some of the techniques used to entice the collector to purchase Randall’s on ebay follow:

1. No stone in the stone pocket. Stones are one of the areas that in conjunction with spacer arrangement, sheath maker and style, and blade grind help date a Randall.

This being the case of trying to have a knife appear older than it is, and outside of putting an older style stone (another trick) in the pocket of a newer knife, simply leave it out! The ruse allows the seller to “play dumb”, if it is brought to his attention by a sharp collector, in the know, using some of the other dating methods mentioned, that the knife for sale, is incorrectly dated.

1. No attempt whatsoever by the seller, in learning about the spacer arrangement or other dating factors and simply stating whatever time period (i.e. Viet Nam) will help the seller realize the most money in a sale, so that is how the Randall is “dated”.
2. One of my favorites: The War Story. Ever notice how a knife, using quotes from actual ebay auctions “wreaks of the jungle” or “wreaks of Viet Nam service”? Then you have the “got it from a Veteran”. “I was told it was carried in Viet Nam”. “Looks like it has been there and done that”, “the right vintage and correct amount of use (whatever that is) to have been in Nam”, “the knife speaks volumes”, and perhaps the best, the horrific result of hand to hand combat – “blood stains”!! DO NOT be sold on this crap!! Everyone wants the knife they have for sale to be desirable, but these sale ploys designed to entice someone into believing they are purchasing a combat carried or any vintage Randall really stink.
3. I reserved this space to devote to the most utterly ridiculous, ignorant, and irresponsible description of a Randall knife up for auction – “The prefect balance and eye appeal of a killing machine, in such a cool symmetrical package”. This verbatim description was for a model #2 (stiletto) which as we all know is already illegal (why?) to posses in some areas. Hard to believe but true. I don’t think this type of rhetoric is healthy for the hobby.
4. I figured I would throw this one in also. Models 14, 15, and 16 had an unlined thong hole in the Viet Nam War period, probably until 1971 or so. An unlined thong hole from the Randall shop will be 5/32″ and most often beveled. One that has been drilled out will be a minimum of ¼” and quite often not beveled. I have seen a few on ebay and have seen some at shows so be aware. One thing in your favor is it does take a little work to do it, so you won’t see a lot of them floating around.

I hope some of this information will be of use to you. The key here is that if you are unsure about the age of a knife you are bidding on, or are considering purchasing at a show, ask someone to give you a hand before you buy. Also, give the Randall shop a break and don’t email photos of knives or forward auctions for their opinion. You will not get a response and just increase the workload of an already busy staff.

I will leave you with one last thought and will quote Mike Silvey, a good friend, collector, and author who told me, “Joe, a story is worth two cents. Unless you have solid provenance, i.e. photos, service records and like, and/or a letter (preferably notarized), buy the knife, not the story”.

**Note: While this article was written12 years ago, some of the tactics mentioned then are still used today. Ebay was basically in its infancy at that time, and it was a new arena for marketing products and buying and selling goods. So some of the things I quoted the folks said in auctions back then were a bit on the extreme side, and I don’t recall seeing things of that type in the past several years, but I also don’t spend that much time on ebay so I can only go on what I have seen of late. What I have seen of late though is some sellers still claiming their knife is from the Viet Nam war period when it clearly is not and sometimes not even close, often by a decade or more. The point being that there is enough information out there for seller and buyers alike to make informed decisions when listing or bidding.